Bro bitcoiners before ho bitcoiners

1 BTC is 1BTC when the price stays the same or increases, but if it goes down, 1 BTC is $89,000 😂

Ho how, same difference 🤣😂🤣

This is true. People still don't understand the scarcity of this asset. For me #bitcoin is even more important than scarcity itself, it is #sovereignty

That’s probably why you and I are peasants 🤣😂🤣

Exaaaaaactly! Time to grab some sats

🤣🤣🤣

I relish in bear 🐻 markets.

Made me giggle 😆

Those ho Bitcoiners, you've gotta watch out for them because they're just after your sats 😂.

Yeah, no. One single unexpected quantum computing breakthrough can end all of Bitcoin. Don't think hanging the future of the world's money on a currency that can be ended by a single press release is a good idea.

name checks out then. 🙃

as always, snark but no argument about why quantum isn't a existential threat. because there is no argument.

For sha256 quantum is not an issue. For EC encryption it definitely is, so some addresses are not safe. You are both right 😂

for secp256k1 it's all about timing. if a shor's attack happens quickly enough, that's also the end of the story. but don't count out grover's and sha256 either, quadratic speedup is a real thing, it's all about creative attacks and the speed of the quantum machine.

Still a hard problem given we are still scratching our heads about packing of quibits and not getting overwhelmed with noise. But then again, we thought md5 and DES was secure, or Enigma at some time in the past. The short story is, nobody can predict future

100%. It’s also entirely possible we discover new quantum algorithms, right now we only really have two of concern. There could be a number out there. And of course, we really have no idea yet the degree to which AI can supercharge error correction and noise reduction

If quantum allows for dozens of orders of magnitude faster cryptographic computations (no serious quantum people are saying this, they are saying the exact opposite — this is not how quantum computing works, it isn’t magic) everyone can just use bigger key sizes and all miners will adopt the new quantum strategies. We will end up with every wallet being a n-key multisig underneath and the block difficulty will rise exponentially to reflect the new ease of mining. But within a very short time, such breakthroughs would be priced into the computation difficulty of Bitcoin.

You would have an interim period with some severe volatility for sure — the actual thing that would happen was like when Ghash.io did enable double spends against SatoshiDice. This stuff has already happened in Bitcoin before. It isn’t the end of the world, and certainly did not permanently eliminate the viability of Bitcoin. It caused a price drop of roughly 5% when it happened. It’s bad, but it is a temporary thing that is mitigated by requiring more confirmations.

Good points, we are all in agreement it seems

It’s not at all comparable. Think it through, if there was an actual shor’s attack before any real immune system developed what are all the things that would happen in the next few months after that was launched.

ho bitcoiners that start with 1BTC? Sounds expensive.

The attacker could work out the private key from the public key of any Bitcoin address whose public key has been revealed on the chain. Think about that. (Again this is nothing to do with SHA256). Dormant whale wallets, especially from early years, all immediately drained. Following that (and assuming this all happens before any post-quantum resistance has had the chance to propagate) the % of total Bitcoin supply that would be drained by the attackers would likely be around 30%. (The attack team can drain the exposed wallets before the community can even migrate a small fraction, this is all very well prepared. The theft of this pool is almost guaranteed once a capable quantum computer is revealed.) You now have some random team, in some lab somewhere in Asia, in control of 30% of the supply of Bitcoin. Exchanges, wallets, and institutions would likely halt all Bitcoin transactions and withdrawals to assess the damage and prevent further theft, effectively paralysing the network. Short-range attacks (funds being moved exposing their wallets) means nobody who's wallet is not exposed moves anything either. The list goes on. GHash.io this absolutely is not.

Ho ho ho 😂🤣😂

The number of qubits necessary for a Shor’s attack against key size n is well known. There will be a runway for changes when it starts getting close. Changes can be accommodated years in advance. You think there won’t be some sort of mechanism to mitigate this? It will be like adding Bech32 support. There will just be a new address format and people can move their Bitcoins into it before it becomes an issue, most likely using one of the NIST competition signing scheme winners. All this doom and gloom is pointless.

This is very wishful. There is absolutely no guarantee of "years in advance" notice, no assurance of a comfy migration to NIST keys on bitcion's own time (whenever one of those keys is agreed upon.) The number of qubits is not known, there is a fairly broad range with a lower bound. Much (potentially most) quantum research is happening in China, so the idea that there would be little breakthroughs announced one by one, year by year, is not always applicable. Same goes for parts the US research machine. This can essentially be seen as weapons research, people don't get that part. As far as for what we do know, Quantinuum has demonstrated 48 error-corrected logical qubits. We may need, say, 2,000 of those. We don't know. And as mentioned, we really have no idea how AI will software-supercharge error correction, or if there are other undiscovered algos that can reduce the qubit need, all of a sudden we wake and need half the qubits we thought we did. Even if you see this as an outlier threat, you have to take it very seriously.