Replies (36)
IMHO monero is wonderful ecash, (cash as in an immediate exchange vehicle) but a shitty asset as these things are quite different, which seems to be under appreciated in general.
Furthermore, I think bitcoiners and moneroeans(?) are mostly on the same team. I want to see more collaboration than shit-slinging personally.
I want to see bitcoiners and moneristas stop measuring value in US dollars.
"Bitcoin was created for fiat NGU"
is fiat thinking
You are a fool if you believe any coin in the top 200 that gets currently pumped 25% to 100% while Monero dumps -10% has any more value whatsoever.
It gets attacked for years. And you are congratulating the attackers.
That's even a new low for Bitcoiners.
Guess DOGE is a much better investment then. Despite it having more inflation than Monero and no privacy.
And what is true for Monero is true for all other shitcoins. They get pumped by fiat cantilionaires and the Tether printer.
It won't happen for Bitcoin. With Bitcoin on the balance sheets of central banks and states they buy much more time for USD.
Most Bitcoiners are now sell outs to fiat NGU mindset. Deluding themselves that it will magically make the non fungible token that is Bitcoin - money.
Never going to happen. The crypto revolution is now in Moneros hands. But this has been known for 5 years already. Especially when attacks on Monero started in 2019.
Yes, price is not where I think it should be. But it held up, there is an economy running on monero.
Where is the chart that shows the traced bitcoin addresses? We don't get to see it because the companies keep a tight lock on it.
Comparing only price is not the whole picture in my opinion. Censorship resistance matters, but can't really be quantifiesd.
as another old guy
gotta say
obsessing over the USD denominated "buying power"
is bullshit fiat thinking
but some people would rather be rich than free i guess.
Yeah, I'm not monero maxi, but Bitcoin will be useless without privacy in the future. When they start taxing high amounts and unrealized gains on Bitcoin, the fun and games will be over no matter how hard someone stacked.
this.
the only property you can be said to really own,
is the one nobody knows about.
Lightning is much more private than Monero, ARK much more than Lightning.
That is huge cope. Just take your Bitcoin off of the secure L1 and risk saving it on Lightning for privacy?
Literally NO ONE has ever done that and will ever do that. Might as well throw away your seed phrase in that case.
In the future not everyone will have the right to use layer 1, ARK for example offers privacy by default and without custody, also because of its architecture you can have hardware wallets in the absence of solving the problem of the rounds with the notes.
With bitcoin L1 you can use coinjoins and get the same or more privacy than with Monero.
On the other hand Monero is not scalable and its dynamic block size equates to losing decentralization if it were to be massively adopted.
"In the future not everyone will have the right to use layer 1"
Brilliant. The resounding success of "sound money" - accessible to the privileged alone, afforded none of the benefits of security as a tradeoff of percieved anonymity.
Have you ever run a lightning node?
"With bitcoin L1 you can use coinjoins and get the same or more privacy than with Monero."
Samurai says hi. Coinjoins will be eliminated in the process, they already are working on getting rid of them and jailing anyone working on them.
You seem to spend a lot of time attacking Monero. Why are you so concerned about it if it's not scalable, not decentralized and keeps losing value to Bitcoin?
Do you think this is an effective strategy to win over people who value privacy as a defence mechanism against the state?
I don't care about Monero, it is the followers of Monero who have constantly attacked me and as I see where you're coming from I'll leave the conversation here.
So you haven't run a Lightning node, have you?
Pretty ballsy speaking about something you don't seem to have experience with.
I'm being pretty candid in my arguments here. I didn't mention scalability. You are being short-sighted in an attempt to win an argument that doesn't really need to exist. Maximalism is toxic, be it monero or Bitcoin.
Stay humble or get wrecked.
You don't care about Monero and your name is cypherpunk, something is wrong here
explain how you know this please.
in fact
please explain how ANY end user can evaluate the privacy guarantees they achieve in a specific LN txs
I'll wait.
because you cant and your statement isnt based on anything but a theoretical
"an L2 could *maybe* be more private because of no on-chain footprint"
Unrealized gains tax is not gonna happen, no shot
I think it is highly unlikely, but it depends on how desperate they and their situations get.
Remember when Greece reached into people's bank accounts and took their money? Same same
I suppose that’s why self-custody is such a blessing
Lightning is not anywhere close to as private as Monero.
And I hold both Bitcoin and monero.
I think they both have a use.
But why HOLD monero? Why not just use it for private transactions? Is the privacy worth the haircut?
Man, you are the ine cheering state attacks against Monero.
I use Monero frequently enough that I am beginning to commonly recognize how much things should cost directly in Monero was very little thought. I guess this feeling would be similar to something experienced by a frequent traveler between two countries that uses both currencies because I can do the conversion in my head fairly quickly and be pretty close to accurate.
"how much things should cost"
is still a USD measurement though isn't it?
because people aren't denominating prices in XMR
sigh
it isnt XMR denominated when you take the USD value and divide by the USD price of Monero.
Thats still a USD UoA.
Thats the whole point of what Im saying.
You have to buy the goods you're selling in Monero for something, whether it's dollars or sheep or gold or silver or whatever, you have to buy it with something in order to put it into the Monero economy. You're not just being given the items for free.
yeah i get it
and those prices are denominated in USD
which is why usd is STILL the UoA
that doesnt stop until we have circular economies that don't touch fiat
Right, but to do that, we're going to need manufacturers and farmers and miners, etc. We need actual resources to be denominated in Monero as they are pulled out of the ground or roll out the factory door, etc. But in order to even get companies like that interested, I think we need to get the price of Monero to stabilize. And what I am doing is attempting to help at least that little bit.
I totally agree
just saying that
until then
its not changing the UoA
It is changing the unit of account between you and the business, but it is not changing the unit of account between the business and the supplier. You as an individual, though, get to denominate prices in Monero and save in Monero if you wish.
UoA IS NOT the medium of exchange between two parties.
UoA IS the base currency prices are denominated in.
people are consistently confusing those two things
and the difference matters.
It's a step in the right direction for people to use a different Medium of Exchange,
but it does not effect the underlying unit of account.
People can transact in bales of cotton or barrels of oil
But as long as the *amount of cotton or the *amount of oil is decided by the USD equivalent value of those things,
then the unit of account is still USD.
damn. true
Why looking the chart ? I mean, is it really important ? Is this crypto ? I don't care about the price because the bank or the government will not be able to freeze my Monero account, and this is priceless 😃
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