Replies (159)
Not enough people/businesses accept monero
I am a plain number of utxo’s in self custody go up idiot thank you very much
Bitcoin on chain scaling solved yet?
Seth For Privacy
If the only solution for Bitcoiners to have private payments is custodians (be it e-cash, Fedimints, etc. as is all the rage) then Bitcoin will simply be dead for me. Feels like the ultimate cop-out.
Custody is the line in the sand that cannot be crossed. Custody not only opens up immense risk for loss of funds, it also makes these tools far less resilient to adversarial environments.
Can "they" stop every Bitcoiner from keeping 12 words safe? No.
Can "they" stop a few popular mints from operating? Absolutely.
View quoted note →
Also most people dont place much value in privacy. We have enough trouble telling people bitcoin isn't just money laundering / drug money / terrorism financing. Imagine explaining Monero to them.
Truth. Ecash is cypherpunk af for specific purposes and small amounts but no way would I feel comfortable holding significant funds with a mint.
yes
be like most people, get what most people get.
so you can have funds which can not be moved. much wow.
I think you mean "number spendable from my utxos go up" unless you like collecting dust!
install cake wallet
This one?
Well, that means that when you start using Monero, you will be one more person. And then the next person will have one last person to say that about.
I use Monero for savings and Monero for spending. I own no other cryptos.
Why for savings?
Because I'd rather the world not know how much I have in my savings account.
How would they know if you got it non kyc?
You'd have to make sure to do absolutely everything at all times, non KYC, because if I transferred money from my savings account to my checking account and then spent it on, say, a domain, for example, then my savings and checking are both now known with KYC.
Idk what you mean by savings account. If you hold non kyc bitcoin for savings, you can just swap to monero when you want to spend it right?
On-chain bitcoin doesn't scale to 8 billion people, so there will be layers and custodians. Why can't we have mints like we have relays, the more the merrier?
I still think L1 privacy will matter. But it’s gotta be reasonably priced to matter. Otherwise only bad people will use it.
> only bad people will use it
That is the trap they are setting. How about: only people who deem privacy important enough will use it.
Yeah, you can. But why would you want anybody being able to view your savings account balance, even if they don't know it's you? It just seems like a bad idea to have regular users having their net worth publicly showable online.
It’s not your net worth. It’s just one utxo. And it’s pseudonymous so no one knows it belongs to you. Don’t reuse addresses.
I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm simply giving the normal person perspective. Most people still store their wealth (if any) in fiat, have 0 financial privacy, and have the full risk of rug/censorship by their bank. Most do this despite knowing about Bitcoin, "crypto", etc.
So just like Bitcoin in 2010...
Yes, and a regular person is never going to make the mistake of transferring money from their savings account to something that has KYC on them. It's just too easy to dox yourself on total accident then to keep Bitcoin private. You as a privacy person on Bitcoin have to think, did I use that address? Does this address I'm going to send to have any way of linking to me with KYC? Are these funds tainted? A Monero user just presses send and doesn't have to worry about that.
Yes, back when Bitcoin making a change from the corrupt cartels and cronies to give human freedom back.
Most people think cookies are fun internet points 💀
How have I missed out on gains? One Monero is still worth one Monero. It hasn't changed in value at all. If you're talking about Fiat, then we're talking to totally different stories. I don't care about Fiat. I want more Monero. People who look at the price want more fiat, and that's just not the point.
And that wouldn't be a bad thing at all, except for the privacy implications. It makes it a total non-starter.
No one here vouching for Monero has missed out on any gains. We were here since the very beginning.
The question you need to ask yourself is, WHEN you care more for your safety than another fiat multiplier.
Fast forward 10 years from now, when BTC will have reached its full investment potential and behaves more like boring paper traded gold. Still see no value in privacy for your wealth?
Sooner or later any Bitcoiner will come around to Monero. Why do you think fiat offshore accounts exist?
To be fair though, if you want to save in Bitcoin and spend in Monero, that is perfectly acceptable. It's just not acceptable for me.
I see, the maxi fallacy that one can only own one coin at a time and also only starting in 2018.
When I say we have been here since the very beginning I don't mean 2018. I mean the early days of Bitcoin. How do you think we could have come up with Monero ten years ago without using studying and examining Bitcoin beforehand?
Right, and I ended up sending you another reply and just saying that if you want to save in Bitcoin and spend in Monero, then I see no problem with that. But it's personally not the way I've chosen to do things.
Taxes will diminish your purchasing power. That's why rich dudes store value in offshore banks giving a fuck about inflation.
Everything is relative.
Never said you can only use one coin. I said you can save in bitcoin and spend in monero if you don’t trust bitcoin.
Relatively speaking, you’d still have more purchasing power after taxes in bitcoin than monero 🤷♂️
I guess we agree more than we disagree then.
I used to be 100% BTC. Now I am mostly XMR. And I know for a fact that I am not the only one experiencing this phenomenon. It is a slow shift in valuing different aspects more over others.
For now. Imagine what KYC, meta data and AI can do for your pseudonymous BTC addresses in 10 years from now.
Sad state of affairs
Bitcoin's doing a thing I don't like and I say NO MORE! Stop it, you naughty unstoppable thing.
Seth For Privacy
If the only solution for Bitcoiners to have private payments is custodians (be it e-cash, Fedimints, etc. as is all the rage) then Bitcoin will simply be dead for me. Feels like the ultimate cop-out.
Custody is the line in the sand that cannot be crossed. Custody not only opens up immense risk for loss of funds, it also makes these tools far less resilient to adversarial environments.
Can "they" stop every Bitcoiner from keeping 12 words safe? No.
Can "they" stop a few popular mints from operating? Absolutely.
View quoted note →
Blinded path and PTLC would make LN payment much more private. Not perfectly private but enough if you are not an Al Capone type of criminal
"If the only solution"
It's not, though, is it?
Therefore bla bla bla.
No. I really mean bad people are the only people who will use unreasonably priced privacy.
Let see when bitcoin will become illegal without kyc XD.
The government doesn’t determine which transactions get mined
you don't hold it in the wallet for long because you're just using it for privacy. you once you receive nuts you immediately exchange for sats by sending them to your own wallet.
also, can't the mint just log which token they issued and the users ip address? for example a mint run by the feds as a honeypot?
I think so?
Yes
So for example, politically persecuted people are all bad?
Oh, but they sure as hell can. They can get together and tell the miners in their country they either have to shut down or not mine these transactions. And if those are more than 51% of all mining power, then that's it. Even if your transaction gets mined, they could just orphan the block.
That is a fair point. How long can your transaction be delayed though? And how long can you withstand it being delayed? Is the real question? If it were your rent for, say, then you would not be able to withstand it being delayed very long.
Transactions cancel after about 2 weeks. You can also increase your fee while it is in the mempool using RBF which incentivizes more people to mine it. If all your sats were doxxed and you were being censored, it would be bad. But I don't think they would go to the miners to censor you if they knew where you lived. They could just come arrest you. Now if you are saying they will censor all non kyc sats, that is extremely difficult to accomplish. It's hard to even know what sats belong to who. How many sats are non kyc? Can you force all miners around the world to kyc all new mined sats? Also, people buy kyc sats and then send them in as donations or use them to buy things from other people. And with payjoin, it gets more difficult to track. All this does is add a lot of friction for US miners which other businesses or countries can take advantage of. Do you think America, China, and Russia will come together and agree to censor each other? We already sanctioned Russia so that clearly shows that they can't agree on everything. If the government in the US even hinted that they were going to subsidize bitcoin mining, they would open the floodgates to new bitcoin adoption. What would that do to the confidence of bond holders and the value of the dollar? Other countries would get in bitcoin and try to mine as well. It would pump the price, making mining more profitable, and add new miners to the network from different countries.
This is all very convoluted and we are just speculating about an unknown future. My belief is that the incentive to mine bitcoin is strong enough to overcome censorship. But I admit that remains to be seen. I'd like to see mining pools get more decentralized. I wish bitcoin had more privacy by default but you cant know for certain that there are only 21 million bitcoin if the blockchain isn't transparent. So pseudonymity seemed like a reasonable tradeoff.
ya, ive always found the anonymity set too small argument made against monero to be dumb af, then the btc influencer will turn around and talk for 30 mins about how much diff one person can make for btc adoption 🫠
I think trying to advocate for Bitcoin adoption in order to make a difference is dumb. No matter how many people you orange pill, it won’t make a significant difference in price or political policy. Doing it just because you want to help others and grow your network of friends makes more sense.
I orange pilled people for many years. Now i don't do that anymore. Bitcoin will not give them freedom. Bitcoin will be part of the financial system with full surveillance. Sadly.
I agree that bitcoin doesn’t necessarily give you freedom. I think it’s a tool that can help you get freedom so I still refer to it as freedom money. But getting freedom comes down to the efforts of the individual. His mentality, his understanding of people that can hurt him, and the time he puts in to preserve his liberty. But I disagree with your other point. I think eventually fiat dies and governments won’t be able to afford to surveil everyone. It could get ugly before that happens and the ones that didn’t prepare, won’t have that freedom.
Idk if you read mandibles but toward the end of the book, the protagonist realizes that the country couldn’t actually stop people from leaving to a different jurisdiction that offered more freedom. They could only use propaganda to scare people into thinking their chips would self destruct and kill them when they crossed the border and that the other jurisdiction was a crime infested and uninhabitable disaster. They also couldn’t afford to keep military or police forces at the border to stop people from leaving. He realizes that it was all a bluff because they couldn’t afford to do anything more.
build a network of like minded people
build a online business / income stream
leave while you still can
get a second passport.
look for a country which gives you more freedom or live as a perpetual traveler
invest in stuff they can not take from you
wait it out until the welfare states collapse
If you’re doing all that, Bitcoin should be fine for you right?
Can the ip address be blinded ?
Yea tor mixnet vpn i2p
Never heard about OFAC Sanction or what lol 🤣
Darknet is dominated by monero
Dex (real one) p2p trading dominated by monero
Gift card Market dominated by monero
Yep
It's looking more like btc got hijacked everyday lol 😆
You're 100% right both are at odds. The longer you wait the more you expose yourself to rug pulls. But if privacy and anonymity is your goal it's better to wait.
Good question. I think the only thing a mint knows is if a token is valid (or not) and all ip addresses that interact with it, but not necessarily what specific tokens your ip address is associated with since token creation is blinded if I understand correctly. This FAQ has a lot of our questions in it:
Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs) - Cashu.space
Frequently asked questions
All ip addresses that interact with the mint, not any particular token*
How do they know you have it if you get it non kyc?
Not in Bitcoin
i guess sooner or later they will mandate digital id for anyone who accepts btc payments. as the payments are transparent, how do you want to circumvent that?
If they could do that to Bitcoin then they would do it to monero too. But if somehow they didnt, then I’d just swap to monero and get those gift cards you mentioned.
Thank you. TLDR, need to read it completely later.
So how do i have to understand that? You have a wallet or a website you interact with, it displays you the ecash string, it has to have the ability to log that string. I dont say it does but you have the ability to create the client in that way that it can log it, no?
Also really funny for me ( from the faq):
CAUTION: Choose mints where you trust or know and trust the operator. Use small amounts or immediately redeem tokens or swap tokens to your own mint.
Who the fuck says openly: "Hi, i am Joe Schmock, i am your friendly ecash operator running this Mint, i live in 123 Retardvillage. If you want to arrest me, just come by, i have not learned anything from the Tornado cash lawsuit. Apart from that, use my tokens so you can buy drugs anonymously online. Love to you all. "
Am i getting something completely wrong here or are they delusional?
They can not do that to Monero, that is the point.
Why not?
Because nobody can say if you own any, which addresses you have, if you have any at all.
There is a reason why ransomware payments are done in monero
They don’t need to. A fed just needs to pay for something in monero then arrest the business owner for not complying with KYC. Make an example out of a few businesses then everyone else will be too scared to touch monero.
An old Chinese proverb says, “kill one, warn a thousand.”
if they know who is the seller, see darknet markets.
I don’t use the darknet markets. Tell me how I can use monero to buy steak from the grocery store.
me not either. why would you buy a steak with monero?
Isn’t that the point of money lol
Why not push for payjoin to become widely used as default on wallets?
ok.
So when they force digital ID on everyone and businesses require it, how can I buy steak, electricity, gas, medicine?
If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
I actually thought this conversation was going somewhere productive but it sounds like you don’t have an answer. If they force digital ID on everyone, which is very difficult to do, then your little monero gift card swapping platform would also be forced to comply. Then your monero privacy becomes worthless.
Sadly let me remind you OFAC Sanction of Transaction started in btc first in the world
Which utxos are sanctioned?
There is something called brave search or try using Twitter for smooth brain these days
Easy to search info lol
Burden of proof is on you. You made the claim so provide evidence for it.
No it's not my job to spoon feed free info that peeps are too lazy to search lol 🤣
Without providing any evidence, your claims are worthless. Have a good day.
the conversation and your questions are actually pretty boring.
it does not require a high iq to imagine that there will be people who do not comply, like people buying drugs now or evade taxes nowadays. if they use a value transfer system which allows them to stay anonymous, they can do their own thing. if they use a public ledger without privacy, they can not. hard to get?
Here Type OFAC Sanction in Nostr Search enough info for even dumb dumb children to know basic stuff lol 🤣
Logical fallacy: moving the goal posts. I asked a simple question, don’t change the subject.
How can I buy things that are really important and essential to my life like steak, gas, and medicine? I don’t need things from the darknet. I know some people will not comply but most will and that is a problem. So how do I get those things that I need with monero if they require digital ID from everyone?
The first 3 articles I searched made no mention of Bitcoin. You’re wasting my time.
That's not how Nostr Search of topics work lol 🤣
Okay then provide your evidence or I’m muting you
Bitcoin was BUILT on #civildisobedience Grow a pair; disobey.
Matt Corallo : It’s not that I’m a fan of the nuclear option, but rather that I have no *other* ideas if things like Sv2/p2pool don’t get adoption. We’ve been at this for a decade and it’s been a massive problem for a decade.
Edit : now good luck following the same btc dev who created all the mess lol 🤣
If u still can't search after this then you are in btc land special case lol 🤣
I understand that. You seem to not understand the context of what I was saying.
This makes zero sense and is not evidence that bitcoin transactions have been censored due to ofac. You must be retarded. Have a nice day.
Too lazy to even search lol you sure are in btc land special case lol 🤣😂
You lucky you seem not yet to have met #theCabal in full extermination mode #covert #occultwarfare ... Your time will come. Choices. Not easy choices. I took the hard choices, to do the hard things; remain free. I'm £33,000,000,000,000 or so in #remotetorture to #suicide later. I'm still free. ;)
ps I know them well #BritishArmy trained #warfighter and ... I #knowmyenemy ... And tip: they'll exterminate you harder if you're a wimp.
They have no respect for people, who won't even fight to protect their very own life (never mind others' lives).
Those who can't even muster up a little #civildisobedience
@MAHDOOD oh bro, they're so #mincemeat already they're walking dead. RIP.
"How can I buy things that are really important and essential to my life like steak, gas, and medicine?"
OK. You want serious responses?
@MAHDOOD 2 of those are not essential; grow up little boy in warzone.
You’re taking my replies to another conversation out of context. I’m not interested in being a soldier. I know I don’t NEED those things but I want those things. I want steak and a good quality of life. If I can’t have that, then I’ll leave the jurisdiction and live somewhere that treats me better. We can practice civil disobedience but it has limitations. The majority of people will comply. That’s reality. You can’t change that. If you think arguing with nyms on nostr will wake up the world to tyranny and educate everyone on the importance of privacy, then you must be retarded.
But that’s not what we are arguing about. I was asking the monero shill how monero is better for me than bitcoin if the state implements a digital ID. He failed to explain that. So GFY. muted.
For those interested in my reply (not Mahood, but ...).
"You’re
taking my replies to another conversation out of context. " Maybe, shame you missed the apology for doing so through the #mute. ;)
"I’m not
interested in being a soldier. " Few are, but when extermination by military means comes unwanted through the wall ... It's already too late to be taking decisions about what you might do.
"I know I don’t NEED those things but I
want those things. I want steak and a good quality of life. If I can’t
have that, then I’ll leave the jurisdiction and live somewhere that
treats me better. " Oh so clueless about #GlobalDictatorship (which is ... ironic considering the point he thinks he was trying to make).
"We can practice civil disobedience but it has
limitations." Incorrect. Logical conclusion (if you're upset enough) is of course #RightToRevolt (enshrined in law if you're a US citizen).
"The majority of people will comply. That’s reality. You
can’t change that. "
Look what happened during #COVID ... no arguments on your above. But I have #NaturalLaw rights.
"If you think arguing with nyms on nostr will wake up
the world to tyranny and educate everyone on the importance of privacy,
then you must be retarded. "
No retarded people call people names on social media and then mute them.
(that's a form of #abuse). #HitAndRun Nice.
"But that’s not what we are
arguing about. I was asking the monero shill how monero is better for me
than bitcoin if the state implements a digital ID. He failed to explain
that. So GFY. muted."
I tried. He's just another clueless ... set to die. Why?
There's only two types of people in a warzone;
1) the hunter;
2) the hunted.
Choose wisely. Whilst
@MAHDOOD ... runs ...
(back to the enemy, I personally never found wise).
Mainchains do not scale even with 12tb drives.
If zaps had to be written on everyone's node that would fill up quick.
Monero works as a niche, but with a large amount of success it'll crumble.
The ASIC resistance will be regularly cracked when there's market incentive to do so.
The blockchain size will be stupid and unpredictable if it became popular.
I used to be on the ASIC resistance side back in 2017 but learned how difficult it is to keep fair.
I'd rather the rules be set and the market competes.
I run Bitcoin the og way, its possible with a few hundred dollars and hours.
you are interpreting stuff i did not write
Hey daddy, tell me what to think!
dont waste your time on that kid, he is some low iq loser who can not think for himself, i muted him.
if they have the miners they can.
Dony read only the bold characters XD
This is not a len,k==>chainalysis.com/blog/ofac-sanctions/
Who talk about the sats, they will only go to the green and red address.
If ur keys are kyc and u are know u are green.
if ur keys are non kyc u will be targeted by any agency and get u an ID or go to jail.
Like always it won happen in one take. Just some turn up time to time the heat.
So if i follow ur reply Mahdood, bitcoin mining are not decentralize.
And privacy is lacking, is that correct ?
what an individual miners aka anon can do against big corrupt money and infinite money that pay those big miners ? Remember its all about hash power in bitcoin mining. A pretty big gape in mining security.
But u will go to jail w shady stuff on ur back.
tornado cash, samourai, and all list of ofac
Cheers for the tip. I found the mute button for the first time too. Nice. :)
No, you're not delusional, it is definitely a concern. Users will be more willing to trust known mint runners with a good reputation, but that makes the mints easier targets for the state. Anon mint runners would be harder to find, but easier for them to rugpull users without consequence.
The arguments I hear are that federated mints would at least make it harder to rug users, ability to quickly spin up/move mints to better jurisdictions, and to only keep spending cash on it them - not large amounts you can't afford to lose.
Even though I think the strong privacy/offchain/instant aspects of ecash is cool the major problem I have a hard time getting past is reintroducing trusted intermediates again when the whole point of Bitcoin was to remove them
Yep
OFAC blocks sanction & empty blocks attacks are very popular attact surface for sure on surveillance coins like btc
What happens when tomorrows 12TB is how we look at 12GB today?
All of what you say heavily depends on the rate of adoptions and if it remains a niche doesnt it?
Consumer tech is not static and technological development is not static either.
i.e. implementing bulletproofs shrunk Monero transaction size by ~80%
You're basically saying Monero will suddenly become so successful that it will break (a problem that is also possible for Bitcoin and more likely for it's popularity). What a great problem to have. And if it doesn't gain that crazy level of success (most likely case) then what is the problem? It still remains a useful tool for many.
Same. Especially considering ~95% of Bitcoiners KYC and don't coinjoin let alone every spend. They speak as if all Bitcoin is their anon set when in reality it is a microscopic fraction of their peers coinjoining with them.
You still don't understand that Bitcoin & Monero are ultimately black market money (the only markets that are permissionless) and it's entire premise relies on that. Any honeymoon period is fleeting. We already see them cracking down with recent events.
The state can make any arbitrary rules they want on white market transactions including banning Bitcoin and Monero.
GitHub
Permissionless Principle
Bitcoin Cross-Platform C++ Development Toolkit. Contribute to libbitcoin/libbitcoin-system development by creating an account on GitHub.
Totally, trusting a FEDerated mint is like trusting the FED. There are also a bunch of people i dont know who say they only have my wellbeing in mind and i should trust them. Where is the difference?
I have read the page you sent me and i have played around with ecash, what i do not understand at all - you get a string from a mint, send it to somebody else and he goes to the mint and pastes that string into a textarea on the mints website.
So the mint can log the ip of who gets the string and the ip of who redeems the string and where is the great privacy in that?
Also the faq you sent me did not answer this question to me.
Also nobody said you need to make the blockchain 12tb now.
Just holding on to the 1mb block size because somebody wants to be able to run a node on a $50 usd raspberry pie or his apple watch and every user on the network needs to suffer from high fees, slow transaction times, terrible self hosted lightning onboarding etc. is just a completely retarded argument.
Just like Bill Gates said in the 80s, 640kb of ram should be enough for everybody...
Scaling the block size to 10mb or so would solve so many problems, help the bitcoin adoption tremendously, make it cheap to open lightning channels, move away from custodial wallets etc.
But, when a majority of the developers is paid by companies which have direct incentives to keep the blocksize small so they can sell their solutions ( Blockstream, Lightning Labs etc. ), this obviously does not happen.
That people say Bitcoin is decentralized when it is actually controlled by a few entities is a mystery to me.
I’ve read this before and I don’t disagree with it. But you missed the context of my comment. I was trying to make that guy prove to me how monero is better off than bitcoin if the government requires digital ID for all purchases. I can’t pay for things like steak, medicine, or my electric bill privately.
These are sanctioned addresses that custodial services are supposed to block. This doesn’t block the addresses or wallets from going into the next bitcoin block. Although that is within the realm of possibilities, I haven’t seen it happen yet. I already mentioned that this can happen before. You should read the entire thread. The government could subsidize mining and take over riot, marathon, and the other big mining businesses then filter out those sanctioned addresses from blocks. However, I also said that the fee market is what determines censorship resistance in money. This is all speculation but if the government announced it was going to subsidize mining, that would legitimize bitcoin to the world. The price would pump and other governments would jump in to mine as well. This inevitably would weaken the dollar which is not what the government would want to do. Other countries like Russia and Iran would rush to gain hash power to prevent the US from sanctioning them. More countries would encourage mining businesses to operate in order to profit and a lot would welcome miners from the US. And as the price of bitcoin goes up, the demand for dollars declines. The government would need to print more money to keep subsidizing and censoring blocks which would drive more people away from dollars and into Bitcoin. They’re shooting themselves in the foot and destroying their currency. In order to be censorship resistant, the censored transactions would have to bid higher fees to incentivize mining those transactions. As those fees get higher, rogue miners go online. This is similar to how “illegal” drug dealers pop up when it becomes profitable to do so. I think this type of government attack will fail. But it remains to be seen.
GitHub
Censorship Resistance Property
Bitcoin Cross-Platform C++ Development Toolkit. Contribute to libbitcoin/libbitcoin-system development by creating an account on GitHub.
people constantly made an argument during the blocksize wars stating "we can't go to 1 TB blocksize by next tuesday so let's not do a blocksize increase at all." it was a stupid thing to say
I see
fair enough
Yea a lot was really stupid, a lot was propaganda and censorship, a lot of promises and vaporware. Now we are here and Bitcoin is fucked.
Lol 0% improvement? can't take you seriously.
There's hours and hours of discussion on this back in 2017.
It is 2024 and we still have a ridiculously small block size which gets treated like the golden cow which can not be changed.
There was a lot of discussion in 2017, a lot of it was false promises, vaporware and lies.
0% improvement on that specific metric.
Are you saying TPS has increased?
And if it has increased, has it kept up anywhere even close to advancements in tech and and consumer hardware/bandwidth?
We can emphatically say HELL NO
yeah wallet format, segwit, batching, etc. all mainchain throughput increases done with a soft fork.
This isn't even talking about the different layers which unlock a whole lot more.
Trying to keep up with hardware through hard forks was never going to work.
There's a reason why Bitcoin mogs everyone else.
Keeping data for frivolous transactions doesn't scale.
Eth was smug as hell until they ran into a wall.
If xmr ever gets going they'll do the same.
Was obviously talking about on chain (which greatly affects lightning being usable as we always see when blocks get full onchain). Layers don't carry over the same fundamental properties that make on chain great. You always sacrifice some form of sovereignty like self-custody or permissionless txs so far.
You say that, but still havent explained why.
Why couldn't Bitcoin even increase it conservatively based off whatever metric was it's bottleneck (just behind bandwidth for example?)
If that is your worry, why hasn't Bitcoin adopted MimbleWimble? MW is even more scalable on chain than even Bitcoin itself. Litecoin already did all the work.
Why not have both parties connect using TOR?
At this point its already known that countrys mine bitcoin as part of their "cover ops". So they wont come up and say they are mining.
so govs take control of major electrical grid and mine w it. Then introduce kyc to anyone. The fees are not matter at this point. Individual mining doesnt matter also as this point. What matter is who win those blocks, which country win those blocks.
They wont be an annoncement about gov financing/mining bitcoin, they also wont legitimize it 'cuz law around the world are "different". And like in those HW they will choose who is in and who is out.
Sure you can do that. But the more hoops you need to jump through in order to get privacy, the more points of failure you have and the more likely it is that you make a mistake over time.
And having to trust a third party for privacy is a mistake in the first place IMO.
The different layers are either overpromised as hell, like self hosted Lightning (neither has the low fees which were promised, nor is it easy to use when you need to manage your own channels)
Or they are owned by companies which take all transaction fees, like Liquid and they will censor your stuff when the Government wants them to.
So it pushes users into custodial wallets and custodial sidechains. There goes your freedom to transact, censorship resistance and self custody.
Welcome to the new bank, just like the old bank but with a new brand name.
This is all speculation about an unknown future. I see things play out differently from you and I plan around that. There is no sense in arguing about things no one can predict. But we have to be prepared to live with the consequences of being wrong. What if the bitcoiners end up being right? Would you be okay missing all those gains? If the answer is yes then you have nothing to worry about. But if the answer is no then maybe consider holding some just in case. No one can guarantee its success or demise. We can only do the best we can with the information we have available to us today.
There are few privacy enabling tools that actually work that don't need TOR to function. Monero is probably the only one I am aware of because of dandelion.
FYI Dandelion only protects you from other nodes that are communicating and only if you are running your own node. It doesn't protect you from your ISP. So, you still need Tor/Proxies/VPNs/Mixnets to protect you from your ISP and/or if you're using a remote node
So it doesn't use encryption to relay the transaction until the dandelion decides to make it public?
So this is how I understand it. Hopefully I can explain it correctly.
Everything is still encrypted like normal of course. Dandelion only protects you from malicious nodes on the network knowing what node broadcasted a transaction.
But your ISP would still know you were the one who broadcasted a transaction (they still wouldn't be able to see amounts/receivers). Does that make sense?
Damn. Is there a way to get monero running in start9? We need that.
Not sure, but all you have to do to protect yourself from your ISP is use Tor or at least a good VPN. But even if you didn't, all they would know is you used Monero. They wouldn't know how much Monero you sent or who received it.
Good to know
Bam!
im not in something for the greed.
Its abvious what its happening, bitcoin will never be use by a lot of people. So let see where the greed will lead. XD
What do you think about Square offering Bitcoin payments? I’m excited because this is a step forward in making our peer to peer payment options so much easier.
