Thread

I can't see that results will be very conclusive though. Imagine a very positive outcome for Nostr with say, 10-100M users, 98% of which are not super technically competent. Almost undoubtedly partially-trusted solutions will spring up (even *fully* trusted), somewhat how they did with LN, although that situation got muddied by regulatory pressures. People will be able to choose how much they need to trust those third parties, and it'll depend on how they use Nostr. Still, you for sure have a point. *Any* use of keypairs and signatures that's more widespread is a good thing from my pov. It will be less pressure here (at least less pressure compared with holding bitcoin as *savings*).

That is the only difference. They keys are literally the same. At least with bitcoin you may have the chance to move your money in the event you know it was compromised, can't do that on nostr. No to mention plenty of sites use nostr login now. Sites like coinos use it, so if my key is compromised so is one of my wallets. We've been doing software signatures too, that's a big deal for more than just the key holder that can compromise a whole community.

Yes, make key management a normie thing. On a separate not, wheres your ln⚡️ address? Cant zap you

AFAIK, zapping currently requires using LNURL, and I'm not interested in either self hosting that infrastructure or outsourcing it. When BOLT12 zapping (perhaps through BIP353 addresses) becomes a thing, I may set it up. Tbh, though, mixing money and social interactions doesn't excite me. I'm not opposed to it, but to me the currency of a good conversation isn't money---its acknowledgement in the form of smiles, laughs, retorts, and the like.

I don’t know how to undo a wallet creation or deactivate it on the app I’m using.

I would highly encourage you to set yourself up to become zappable. Zaps are a crucial part of nostr.

Interesting take. nostr:nevent1qqs0kqh3vmvmuqq4f5um2ppkq38fw383nl5ex5myugvzxjhgcuwszwqpz4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezummcw3ezuer9wchsygyp8l8ycnnk78nmfarf00csxz5s7xst0ql3slfjnqq2fhvxjluhtypsgqqqqqqsfdmguu

I like lightning payment system and use sats ( small amount bitcoin )for daily daily transactions like this primal wallet , Damus or alby or Satoshi . It’s really hassle free for daily transaction .

It takes time for new Comer to set up wallet . As they are pretty much use to old system .very complicated stuff with the documentation needed just to set up wallet . ☺️

I often use lightning for zaps or small payments too… primal, fountain, ZBD and even Muun. None have enough to just break me if rugged but I’d be disappointed. I find value in using all of them

He does have an npub wink-wink

Zaps are not a crucial part of nostr Is this why you've never helped me? Because I won't join your lightning grifter cult?

Zaps are interesting… I have an original thought or create something unique, I often get zero zaps but if I steal a meme from the Fediverse and post here I can get bitcoin! It’s a funny old world… #ProofOfTheft

And can even receive emojis.Though maybe let's not hide the zaps from the noobs at first.

You can just set up a lightning address to receive zaps; it just won't show up on your notes. In my experience though people will still see zaps you send as coming from you. That's how I have things set up with speed wallet, and see no reason it wouldn't work if you've got your own self hosted address as well.

If a zap falls onto an npub but no one is around to redeem it, does it make a sound?

Zesssssh

Some people are lucky to be able to earn a living doing what they love. Others invest their time and energy outside of their regular jobs creating and sharing things that they're passionate about. I want the latter to be able to receive appreciation from the communities they build for with as little friction as possible. I'm usung NWC to send sats regularly to some orgs like Brink, nostr:npub10pensatlcfwktnvjjw2dtem38n6rvw8g6fv73h84cuacxn4c28eqyfn34f and nostr:npub1getal6ykt05fsz5nqu4uld09nfj3y3qxmv8crys4aeut53unfvlqr80nfm Re LNURL vs BOLT12 and BIP 353 - is that a concern over maintenance, security, privacy or something else?

I always had that same feeling about combining microtransactions with microblogging, but, one has to keep an open mind. There are a lot of possible use cases.

I am not convinced that that is true, today. It could be in future. It's worth experimenting, at least.

Totally agree that there are a bunch of confounding variables that limit correlation. However, I think every other proxy we've had for personal key management has failed to achieve popular use: PGP, personal browser certificates, years of DID attempts, etc. So the default assumption at this point might need to be that everyday people can't or won't manage their own keys. Accepting that assumption would have a significant effect on either _how_ we build Bitcoin software or _who_ we build it for. If, instead, we want to continue to build for an anticipated highly self custodied future, it would be really nice to have Nostr to point to as a counterexample of lots of typical people controlling their own keys.

Agreed about the possible use cases. And I also realize that I probably oversimplified things in my previous post. A normal part of my conversations, which are maybe not normal conversations for other people 😜, is suggesting that we make small wagers when we disagree about something easily provable either now or in the near future (my wife and I even use a website, fatebook.io , that let's us collaborate on questions and compare our Brier scores). Zaps would be great for resolving those small bets, rather than having to email LN invoices around like I did for https://x.com/jxpcsnmz/status/1839444666988757306

Re: not using LNURL, it's mainly because I don't like hosting dynamic website code. It requires installing stuff on a server (requiring either a dedicated server or taking a risk with other stuff on the same server), breaks often in my experience, and is just not what I want to spend my time on. BIP353 looks promising because I'll just be able add a field to my existing DNS. All that said, I haven't actually set up either LNURL or BIP353, so I could be confused about what they actually entail.

What crucial role do they play? (Honest question.) For content creators, I think it's probably better to convert readers into subscribers (e.g. BOLT12 recurring invoices), in the patreon model. For content consumers, the patronage model is also probably better at intelligently funding the kind of stuff that's good for you rather than a dopaminergic ad hoc process of zapping. For algorithms, my understanding is that zaps are just an unverifiable statement between two people, e.g. you and I could sign a zap saying that one of us paid the other 1M BTC without even a single sat changing hands. If they were verifiable, they'd seem to give algorithmic advantage to rich people and that doesn't particularly interest me.

It doesn't even have to be a zap. Your lightning wallet could use your nostr contact list. nostr:npub17p5tzzhecgvpj7vxulra5svqmypckhvzzycu3dp5awjxy252r4wqt6xe4n was ahead of its time

I tried to lay it out here: nostr:nevent1qqsqm2lz4ru6wlydzpulgs8m60ylp4vufwsg55whlqgua6a93vp2y4gpr9mhxue69uhhqun9d45h2mfwwpexjmtpdshxuet59upzqmjxss3dld622uu8q25gywum9qtg4w4cv4064jmg20xsac2aam5nqvzqqqqqqy5qzzx0

If you lose your key here, you don't lose your life savings. It's a bitch to lose your social media for certain. But that can be remedied by having a backup account with a different key and mentioning it beforehand. But losing your savings is a real problem. Here we have a lower bar. So if you lose your key here, it's not nearly as big of a deal as if you lose your Monero key.

they keep saying that but zaps aren't really meaningful and are totally unnecessary for nostr