Replies (103)
I like blossom's approach.
https://github.com/hzrd149/blossom/blob/user-server-list/buds/03.md
Could do the same with nip96.
IPFS would work as well but I prefer http unless the file is extremely popular
Same, 58k sats
@nostr.build are we using DNS-based image urls π
most of the internet uses dns
How else do you get a name to your link? But before you allow the Nostr FUD to overtake your imagination, know that DNS is actually decentralized. This includes a bunch of dot servers and a bunch of TLDs owned and cared for by multiple entities, jurisdictions and countries. πΆπΎπ«‘
nothing, Nostr is already immune to DNS failures even though it assumes DNS works most of the time
DNS is the first thing countries do when they need to take you down. You just need to give them an excuse and you will lose nostr.build forever. Then none of our links inside our notes will work anymore. In many cases, countries don't even need to go through court to get you offline. I have seen many domains being lost (redirected) in my lifetime. It's super easy for them to go through.
funny how idk exactly what it is but had to do something to connect this site i built for a fren from (hosting place) to place where he bought domain (namecheap) had to put 4 nameservers on his domain settings
idk what i did exactly but i did it
Most of the Internet is not trying to replace big tech and the fed at the same time.
so you know how to make websites but you don't care to learn what DNS is?
Then donβt use a single domain that relies on the same country. Same as a fucking electric grid. Same as anything for that matter. Why do you think big providers have their NS servers in 3-5 different jurisdictions? Did we learn anything from not keeping your eggs in the same basket? πΆπΎπ€―π€―π€―
making a site on universe is easier than making a meme my fren
and there was a blog post/guide that walked me through the dns thing
Iβd be more concerned about registrars. There a shit ton of crap ones out there. Still using Gandi myself. But Iβd love to hear what others use in a privacy mindset. I know they were acquired and may not be the company they once were. They still beat the hell out of most IMO.
Use multiple with multiple TLDs. One is always vulnerable πΆπΎπ«‘
Two of my relays require DNS, and essentially all the shared images and videos I see.
Nostr itself can work without DNS (as long as Tor is up, for my Onion relays), but man, think of the memes?
The memes must flow. And whoever controls the memes, controls the universe.
I might expose my relay on a raw IP address to add another option, if there is interest in such a thing.
Yes please. Numeric IPs at least require the bastards do some work to take down...
I want to know how nostr.build avoids DNS issues. Learning from you. π«‘
Coming soon.
Doesn't Blossom fix this?
We donβt. The links are static and signed in the notes. There is no interest from any sponsoring entities to support any further development in that domain πΆπΎπ€·ββοΈ
True: ThePirateBay, LibGen and SciHub show it can be done, with enough lawyers and money, and customers engaged enough to follow you around as the Feds play whack-a-mole.
Would be reassuring to have other options, though.
Wouldn't it be possible to use nostr itself as a DNS alternative?
Like, create an identity as "static name" and link your public IP to it's profile, done!
Or something like that, idk shit about DNS, most of the time I've no idea what I'm doing.
DNS is more decentralized than Nostr and IP assigning entities. Even fucking North Korea has its TLD that works πΆπΎπ€―
Where do you think IP addresses are coming from? πΆπΎπ
"A little yes", as my old boss used to say.
95% of the world lives outside the reach of the First Amendment, and 95% of internet users use their ISPs' regulated DNS server.
Countries like Australia and France DNS-poison as a matter of course.
1.1.1.1 and 8.8.8.8 are win, but outside our circles they are little used...
For sure. Because there are so many resolvers out there, itβs mind boggling πΆπΎπ€―
paywalled?
.sv from El Salvador πΈπ» can be a good place to host wallets I guess πΆπΎπ€·ββοΈ
Good luck teaching my mum how to setup custom DNS resolver on her own.
(I've tried. And she has two university degrees, and cares about freedom.)
Nostr.build will survive a DNS takedown, like ThePirateBay did. But that's only possible with a tech-savvy and motivated core audience.
Last I checked, Blosson wasn't free to use, and required some kind of signup. Has it changed?
Last I checked, Blossom was not standardized and had no plans to do so πΆπΎπ«‘
The best way out is to merge all media server providers in Nostr in a single pool and users pay by usage, not by storage. With that, we reduce the race to the bottom on image services while also allowing user to choose a trusted provider to serve as proxy for all images and videos.
Meaning the receiving user chooses the media server, not the sender.
Yes I think we should have an event kind that allows somebody to cryptographically bind an IP address and port (SocketAddr) to a relay's keypair. But we would need:
1) Relays to have keypairs
2) Nostr to reference relays by keypair instead of by url
3) A means of distributing the binding event (because of the chicken-and-egg problem) maybe just blast them, or maybe a DHT.
It's a great idea for nostr2, so nostr2 won't be dependent on DNS and shoudn't need to be dependent on SSL certificates issued by CAs that nobody really trusts anyways.
I think you ignoring the part where someone has to actually moderate things and prevent things like CSAM from circulating. Good intentions, hardly workable in practice. πΆπΎπ«‘
@Vitor Pamplona
If you are using the Brave Browser, centralized DNS is not a problem anymore.
To get a STATIC content, just type on the url bar:
ipfs://[hash-here]
To get a DYNAMIC content, just type on the url bar:
ipns://[pubkey-here]
The great news about this is that we can use nostr pubkey for this self-signed certificate!!!!
I am not ignoring. The nodes can still implement their policies individually. The two most important parts to me are:
- give the receiving user the power to choose.
- move your revenue model away from a race to the bottom
In that framework, CSAM can be managed by both storage providers and proxy providers separately.
Given resources, everything is possible.
Thatβs the catch, given resources. The problem is, there is a lot of fragmentation in the nostr world, so no one idea gets the resources it needs to get off the ground. Itβs like playing wack-a-mole with different half baked standard that are forgotten the moment they are merged. I would love to have more abstraction layers on top of media to make it reliable and resilient, but most of the devs move on onto the next shiny thing, e.g., blossom, IPFS, <next greatest thing after sliced bread> πΆπΎπ€·ββοΈ
I'm just glad these issues are happening so that devs figure out solutions.
I hear you :(
This is an actual problem.
We need nostr-addresses, a la tor hidden addresses.
No reliance on traditional DNS. Make our own.
This is what I meant before about hosting "nostr-based websites".
I woild query a relay, and the relay would check a routing table of sorts, and send me the correct way.
Vitor Pamplona
People look at this and see nothing wrong with using DNS-based image urls or url-based relay hints inside our posts. They are never going to come after our content, right? Riiight?
View quoted note β
For example, we put in an OpenSats application over 7 months ago asking for resources to help with CSAM, building out a decentralized/Blossom type NIP, integration with Primal, searchable GIFs and images, etc. Have provided multiple plans with milestones.. Theyβve asked us to reduce our scope a couple times and still havenβt given us any confirmation of support, and have been radio silent for months now.. All while the BTC price is exploding, and Jack is donating millions..
And we are providing the majority of hosting for nostr! Imagine a smaller or not so well known project.. Apparently you have to be part of the βin crowdβ to get any significant support from OS, FiatJaf, etc. Fishcake and I donβt have enough Twitter followers.. Isnβt there a meme for that? π€·πΌ
LOL dude.
Gotta simp harder.. this is how it works
ππ«
that is absolutely crazy. You guys are absolutely killing it here with your support. In a sense, nostr's bedrock for hosting content.
If it makes you feel better i keep a pretty long list of upload links rather than reuploading images every time i use them
But damnit
@OpenSats open up some sats for nostr.build!!!
π―
I don't think it's about who you know or your amount of reach. I don't believe that for one second.
OpenSats seems to mostly fund developers and not so much development of specific projects. There may be a couple outliers here, but the majority of them seem to be funding existing work, not funding companies or future plans.
i.e. I built this cool thing and I'd love to continue to do this. I need money to continue.
I haven't seen your plans, but based on what they seem to fund and speaking with some board members in an information gathering way, it sounds like reduction of scope seems par for the course.
Maybe reduce to bare minimum and both you and Fishcake both apply individually for your work?
@OpenSats nostr.build is nostr's bedrock for hosting content. They have a lot of ideas, are incredible builders and are clearly executing with their improvements and and features.
I'm going to refer to this note whenever you say something dumb πππ«π«
pls do
Iβm in learning mode 4 lyf π«π«π«
More transparency from
@OpenSats on this whole process would help.
Thats how I do it on my own server. π
Upload a meme once and reuse the link.
SORRY FOR THE POOR COMMS.
WE HAVE AN INSANE AMOUNT OF APPS TO SORT THROUGH AND TRYING OUR BEST TO SCALE OPS AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE. WILL LOOK INTO YOURS PERSONALLY.
That is not transparency
Transparency in the decision process is what you're hinting at?
> Imagine a smaller or not so well known project.. Apparently you have to be part of the βin crowdβ to get any significant support from OS, FiatJaf, etc. Fishcake and I donβt have enough Twitter followers..
I donβt think that this is the problem. There are plenty of grantees that do not have much reach. I get that this is frustrating, but throwing around claims like this doesnβt help either.
I hope that they get back in touch to clear things up.
It also helps that if your a registered user it builds a profile of your uploads on my server. So I can scroll my profile for the meme I'm looking for.
This is the way
Seconded. Talk about proof of workβ¦
We should talk.
This is the same network design we are using at
Vaporware.network
Vaporware
Digital membranes and Nock heresy
Our open source Operation Function π€ Nostr Relays
I am.
followed π€
Handshake amongst others are working on decentralized DNS. A fork of Bitcoin.
> We are providing the majority of hosting for nostr
There's your problem. Are you building a web hosting company, or a solution to censorship-resistant content hosting? It seems more like the former, based on your focus on platform-specific features like content moderation and image search.
Don't get me wrong, nostr.build is a great service to nostr in these early days, but what if a state actor comes to you and asks you to take something down? You'll do it, as would I. Making nostr.build's source code FOSS doesn't really solve that problem on its own.
NIP 96 is a great start to creating an open solution, but much of the spec is concerned with accommodating the needs of image hosts wrt image optimization and transformation. Also, in practice, files are usually referred to by url, not hash. People are excited about blossom because it forces users to refer to files by hash, and doesn't include server-side transforms. It's just a more purist architecture, that makes the benefits of content-addressability clear. NIP 96 isn't necessarily broken, but conventions around its use need to change. Also, serving a transformed file in response to an `ox` prevents users from verifying that the file is authentic, which breaks the guarantees content-addressing gets you.
Pushing content replication based on hash does of course conflict with content moderation for CSAM, which is a great service, and important to the health of nostr for users, operators, and nostr's public image. But it's inherently centralizing. I don't know what the solution to that problem is.
Here's what I would personally like to see from someone focused on image hosting:
- More robust content-addressing, including a referentially transparent mapping between hash and returned file, and better conventions for using these hashes in nostr notes.
- A story for replication of content between servers, including self-hosted ones. Also better discovery of where a particular file is hosted. Blossom has this, in theory if not in practice.
- Decentralized/redundant CSAM scanning, and propagation of reports across servers (without making the reports public, somehow? I know it's extremely hard to manage hash tables in a way that doesn't allow attackers to circumvent them, see
https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2021/08/27/apple-s-csam-detection-with-matthew-green/)
Just my own personal 2 sats.
If youβre serious about transitioning away from centralized web2 URLs, then we should team-up. Weβre launching on the 4th of July. Just wait and see, youβll love it.
πππ»
You guys are the ones I like most do donate my few and hardly earned sats.. because your service, your work and your efforts in the last year and a half on #Nostr is what made it what it is.
I CAN'T IMAGINE MY FEED WITHOUT
@nostr.build
THANKS! π«π
Love you guys! You rock!
More than willing to come and work with
@OpenSats if there are positions available.
And since a lot of what I do is Operating Models and Process Improvement. I can add value in improving efficiencies and scalling. π€π»
The fastest CDN in Nostr by far.
π€βππ«
THANK YOU ππ
Why should anyone use nostr.build vs any other image host? I think people are just using you a lot because nostr is in your url. Maybe you should try to provide a unique service, and then charge for it.
Why canβt I zap this note ?
I think the more likely threat is for content hosting companies like nostr.build to start posting banner ads &/or trackers over everyone's memes. As far as state level attacks It would be far more difficult to censor if we all just hosted on our own domains. Kind of like removing one raccoon in your attic versus an entire termite infestation. A custom domain option from companies like
@nostr.build would be something worth paying for once people realize the value in "owning the path" to their content. It would also protect consumers from outrageous rate hikes because they would be able to migrate their content and keep past notes true.
Example:
Last chance, follow me to follow you back . Iβm serious
Weβve been building this long before blossomβ¦ itβs coming soon, quite literally years in the making now.
@Sirius is with us too. You should all take Merkle DAGs more seriously and understand that files need to be chunked in distributed networks.
I hope the amazing experience of running a
@HORNETS server will open your eyes. Sometimes feeling it is the only answer.
We are ok, please keep to your standard review process. There are other less-known projects that need more help. I just wanted to highlight some of the challenges with timely resources when working across nostr platforms..
Really appreciate the thorough feedback. Most everything has just evolved this way, not necessarily how we planned. Agree we need to innovate further, become more decentralized, but our resources are currently maxed out and that stuff requires a ton more dev/support/legal since their currently isnβt a solution..
We do have a few ideas how to move forward..
Can't wait to see what you're cooking π₯π
I logged into brand new nostr.build with my npub, paid a LN invoice, and now when I post images in Amethyst they just magically end up in my nostr.build account.
That's a unique service.
People running and sharing blossom servers like me is the way
Cool, hopefully it's enough to make them profitable.
Different Blossom??? That could work then
what's blossing? could you share a link?
Thank you sir!
Would the issue be more related to possible censorship ? Csam is the excuse given by governments to pass censorship laws.
Managed to swap to lightning last night and this morning
when you put it that way it seems like a bigger challenge then just shitposting, zapping, and hodling
