Replies (108)
Relax its just an old good book with part truth part science fiction of that age. 🥳🤣🙆🏻♀️
Religions of this age will collapse in the future same as the ancient ones did in the times of Hebrews and co. 😂🤷♀️ as more we evolve yall will realise that those folks were just giving divine features to the unexplained...
Jesus resurrection from the dead is historical fact. Read The Gospels…
View quoted note →If this Jesus stuff happened today, Christians would deny it. That’s the irony.
🤷♀️ wouldnt know... i just see a lot of Christians being very picky and non of them sticking to 10 commandments... cuz a times bible is ... you know... how ever each one of them fits, interpretation wise. I am far beyond that even though I am raised Catholic and received all the sacraments apart from church marriage. I think future will reveal a lot and hypocricy of many, religion wise... all of them are kind of sham... but if humans need religion and belief in heaven and hell to pervent them to harm then so be it... i just rather practice common sense 🥳
I don’t think anything has caused more harm to people than religion. When you consider the number of deaths for the sake of god, it makes little sense that religion is necessary for morality.
True... i agree... im saying that I appreciate those who restraint themselves of doing bad but yes... worst thing is that it didnt stop many... the wars are still lead basically cuz God promised someone land... like seriously?! But the whole world is as we see compliant 🤷♀️🥳🙆🏻♀️ and highly delusional not to mention hypocricy in a lot lot lot...
You’re using “harm” as a moral category to indict God. Where’s that category coming from on your worldview? Atoms and evolution don’t produce oughts, just outcomes.
You have to borrow a transcendent standard of right and wrong to even make the accusation. Which means the case against God assumes the very thing it’s trying to disprove.
Religions are tools for mass manipulation of humanity... imho
Belief in God was the worst thing that could ever have happened to mankind.
If you have a personal relationship with Jesus, take your meds.
Whether he was a historical figure or not has absolutely nothing to do with it.
Most people who claim to have a personal relationship with Jesus are actually worshipping the devil.
Read the Bible, Jesus warned us that these people
“Worst thing that ever happened to mankind” is a moral ranking, and rankings need a standard above human opinion or they’re just preference dressed up as fact.
If God’s not real, that’s just neurons firing that you happen to dislike. You need the very thing you’re denying to make the claim mean anything at all.
Good and bad come from conscious experience. Evolution shaped our brains to recognize suffering, empathy, cooperation, and wellbeing because social beings survived better that way. Atoms don’t create morality by themselves, but they created minds capable of feeling and understanding it. A child suffering is wrong because the suffering is real, not because we need a supernatural source to recognize it.
I think you should read more about human evolution and how our brains developed. Moral feelings did not appear out of nowhere, they evolved because empathy, cooperation, and protecting others helped conscious social beings survive. As i already mentioned... the fact that morality comes from a brain shaped by evolution does not make it meaningless. Our ability to reason also comes from our brains, but that doesn't make logic an illusion.
You cite the Bible to prove Christians worship the devil, then call the Bible’s history irrelevant one line up. Pick one.
And “take your meds” needs a standard for sane vs insane. Where’s that coming from on a worldview with no transcendent reference point?
Comparing morality to logic actually proves the point. Naturalistic evolution can’t ground logic either, it only explains why a brain believes something, not why a law of logic is true everywhere, always, for everyone. Same problem, just moved.
Survival explains what your brain does. It doesn’t explain why anyone’s obligated to follow it. You’re still borrowing binding, universal categories your worldview has no basis for producing.
Evolution explains why we developed morality, just like evolution explains why we developed reasoning. That doesn't make either one meaningless. A conscious being experiencing pain is a real fact, and caring about reducing suffering is a rational conclusion from understanding conscious experience, not something that requires a supernatural authority.
I don't know why you're bothering. Those religious fanatics are never going to see beyond what they've been taught. They've been indoctrinated—that's just how it is. If they'd been indoctrinated to believe in fairy tales, they'd believe those just as blindly. It's a complete waste of time.
Rational conclusion still assumes reasoning tracks truth, and evolution only selects for survival, not for truth. Selected for isn’t the same as sound.
Pain being real just restates the fact. Saying it’s wrong to cause is the actual moral claim, and understanding suffering isn’t an argument for why anyone’s bound to act on it. You keep describing the feeling like that answers the obligation question.
You’re confusing “not supernatural” with “not real.” Our brains evolved to understand reality, not just survive. Morality comes from conscious experience... suffering is real because someone actually experiences it. Adding a supernatural layer doesn’t automatically make it more valid.... we can go on like this till tomorrow but future will disprove the religion and all this so called Gods. Im out of this convo. Have a nice day. Believe what you want. Try conviencing a crocodile to Believe in God... ✨️🥳🖖
He won. In my eyes. 🖖
Evolved to understand reality and evolved to survive aren’t the same claim, and you need the first one true to trust the argument you’re making right now.
Suffering being experienced is a fact. Suffering being wrong is a value judgment, and you still haven’t sourced its authority.
And predicting the future will vindicate you when you can’t win the argument now is its own kind of faith. Good chat. Thank you! 🤙🏼🤝
You seem very knowledgeable about the theory of evolution. Have you read Darwin?
This is very tiring... im not interested in further discussions 🖖✨️🥳
Come on. Hang in there
Ill rather go and play some call of duty. ✨️🖖 as i said if religion keeps you morally grounded im happy if it doesnt that sucks for surroundings. I see the world and existence through different lens. 🤷♀️ and bible for me is just a book. You know we can go on till forever but whats the point?! We reached an impasse... yours your own to me my own...
💥
I think you're right because it happened also during Jesus's time. Most that prophesied His coming denied him when he came.
How am I borrowing a standard?
🎯
I was all alone up in a mountain when god told me I’m a prophet and now you all have to listen me.
Why do you need god to have morals?
That’s the funny part, most of them still deny it today or conflate Jesus’ own teachings or ascribe him qualities he never had or preached. Sunday school teachings are predominantly a lie and aren’t based in biblical facts.
Imagine hating someone so passionately you’re willing to kill them because you think your way of worshipping an imaginary god is better than someone else’s imaginary god. And that imaginary god is supposed to be the same (because Abrahamic religions share the same god). How retarded. A literal circle jerk of retardation by Judaism, Islam, and Christianity.
I’m convinced religions are statist propaganda used to teach subservience of the populace. Like “elf on a shelf” for kids to be coerced to being good or else Santa won’t bring them gifts. Gotta have the WWJD bracelet as a constant reminder that god is omnipresent just like big daddy guberment. Actually, I know that’s fact, because it’s precisely what Constantine achieved by creating the canonical texts and burying anything “contradictory” to the main narrative.
There’s a strong correlation between religious people and the environment to which they grow up. Rarely do you see a person who grew up in a Christian household become Muslim. Or vice versa. They happen, but are few and far between. Why? Because they’d be ostracized by their friends and family, or worse, honor killed by some in Islam.
But not worth arguing tbh. I’ve been through this ad nauseum with zealots. They will do the most contortionist mental gymnastics ever seen to uphold their beliefs. The most insane methods of cope will be had, instead of acceptance of the earth shattering realization that god and the scriptures of any religion are man-made just like the microplastics polluting the world.
There doesn’t have to be a universal why. You can choose your own. But even if you don’t, it doesn’t matter. You will die and be forgotten just like most everyone else.
You’re probably right. The fact that they believe so strongly in their religion simply because of where they were born says a lot.
The Bible plagiarized prior religions so it’s not just a book. Jesus wasn’t the only person born without a father 😂
This is a debate that never ends. Just yesterday I was saying how deeply my mom and my uncle were indoctrinated under communism. Now imagine thousands of years of indoctrination centered around belief in God.
Of course they denied it. It didn’t happen because it’s impossible 🤣
Before statism it was religion. It’s the same thing. The church ruled until people woke up to the lies with the Protestant revolution. Ironically, that Christian movement led to secularism. So now the state is the new religion. And guess what? People fight over democrat and republican shit just as often as people fight over religion. It’s the new and improved religion. The hip religion on the block and Trump is the prophet. If you see the level of cope that people have for Trump then religious people can see how they look defending their delusions.
And the mental gymnastics thing is so fucking accurate lmao contra does the mental gymnastics. His argument for believing in god is that there’s no foundation or groundwork to root any ideology or morality without it. An insanely large jump for a conclusion if you ask me 🤷♂️
You just said "if it happened today". Also, it sounds like you don't know what I'm referencing as far as the denial that was recorded.
I can’t even undo the indoctrination of adults who spent a handful of years in college 😂
If the story happened today.
If the story happened today, he would be widely rejected. It was prophesied in the old testament. I'm saying you're right, you just don't understand why.
That’s just cope lmao literally every religion says that
I didn’t even see who you were replying to lol. My comments weren’t an attack on specifically Contra, but any religiousity in general. I’ve seen him defend his position before and thought he has done it well, even if I disagree with his beliefs or justification for them. The fact he can stand firm in his position and typically is able to debate them without relegating to insults is admirable. Most people will tire early and become frazzled when someone disagrees with them. That’s partly why religious people will hangout with other religious people. Their opinions go unchallenged. Though, it’s a common human trait, irrespective of religion. People like sticking to their tribes. And explaining “why” takes patience and courage, which I think Contra does for the most part.
We can only speak from our experiences
Woah I need to look into this 👀
I pity the atheist and the agnostic guys. I was agnostic myself. They really need to dig into the historical evidence for Christ. Jesus didn’t expect blind faith. He gave us hard evidence. Some of that evidence (the Shroud of Turin) breaks our brains to this day.
@Contra what's your take on Josephus as independent corroboration? most people dismiss it as interpolation without reading the Testimonium.
I especially liked:
"The empty tomb isn’t a vibe someone made up to feel better."
and "Mocking this costs nothing. Investigating it costs your whole framework."
Amen brother!
View quoted note →I want to so badly zap this and it doesnt work. Im writing this .aybe after I post it I will be able... trippy little nostr.
Damn ... i cant zap you and mahdood... grrrr... whats happening 💀
Its a tool 🛠🔧🔨
well said
Romans 1:20: God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been seen clearly in what has been made since the world was created. Psalm 19:1: The skies and heavens tell everyone about the glory and work of God.
its a psyop
It’s a miracle
I got a few zaps thanks 🤙
He wrote about Christ multiple times as a witness in his writings. I believe him
I blame Aristotle 😂
If you're still arguing about the veracity on the facts, you're not getting it either
Huh?
Why? 😂
Aristotle is either or thinking. Dualistic. He doesn’t even have a maybe. That shit has ruined the human mind.
Is this becoming a hell thread?? It was just a meme ...😂😂😂😂
You touched the nerve obviously 😂🥳 hahahahaha ...
you famous now 😂🥳🤣🥳
Just people having healthy debates. It’s all good. It’s good for us. Most people these days will simply block or mute people they disagree with. I appreciate you guys. No hate, I promise. 🤝
I expect to get pushback if/when I post something. If I believe in something and stand by it, I’d better be ready to defend it. I expect the same for someone else who posts something.
So it seems....I was sleeping like a baby while starting and happening.
lol.
@MAHDOOD always keeps me on my toes. I appreciate and respect him. I’ll show you the same respect as well as everyone else.
There are things , like this meme, that I can observe without getting emotionaly involved, aka with detachment. Of course there are topics, specific ones, that will trigger me. But, when that happens, I am learning to look inwards and try to find out why. If it means not engaging, I will not. It's as simple as choosing where to spend my energy in.
I appreciate people who can debate without deflecting or going into attack mode. So I appreciate you. All good!
Yeah i can imagine the utter shock when you saw billions notifications when you logged in. 🥳🤣🙆🏻♀️💀 that is one funny experience i bet. 💀🤣🙆🏻♀️
Thats why I called it an impasse. Cuz we cant agree and no need to go further. We see the world through two different lenses... 🤷♀️ its not the end of the world. You cant agree with me and I cant agree with you... simple as that 🥳
But’s it’s also good listen to the other perspectives. These are all things I worked through. Believe it or not, I once was on your side
Unfortunately, I can't convert to being a believer, just as I don't expect you to stop being one... i completely understand where you're coming from, and I don't feel any need to change your mind either... I just see Christianity differently than you do... to you, it represents a higher power that you genuinely believe in... I simply don't share that belief... I'm open to the idea that there could be something greater than us that set everything in motion, but if such a thing exists, I don't think it's necessarily anything like the gods described by any religion. At the same time, I also leave open the possibility that there doesn't have to be a higher power at all... that our minds naturally search for a beginning because we're conscious beings trying to understand our own existence... maybe we're simply a brief spark of consciousness in an otherwise unconscious universe.... that's how I see it...
Why do you think that’s bad? Not saying it’s good but what’s the reasoning?
I can make it a ⭕️ thread if you really feel dangerous
Literally 😂, but somehow, there are some things that we share that we get that feeling , hmm, this might stear the pot...🤭
Even if someone made a strong argument for the existence of god, which religion do you select? There’s no rational way to pick one over another
MAHDOOD
Religion is indistinguishable from the state because they’re all forms of control.
View quoted note →
I just cant grasp that this so called God would be represented in any of today existant religions. Imho. I just cant... and I am a Christian by how should I say this... birth or something as such... their Gods are non of my favourite existing 'beings' or entities... i prefer dogs 😄🤣 people cant convience me to actually be an active member of any of them. Since the beginning of times we worshipped so many different entities that im convinced that monotheism same as polytheism will sooner or later collapse. 🤷♀️🥳🙆🏻♀️
What would DJ khaled do lol
The Aristotelian idea that to understand something you must know what it is has been abandoned in one science after another, for the pragmatic reason that the simple word "is" introduces so many metaphysical assumptions that we can argue forever about them. In the most advanced sciences, such as mathematical physics, nobody talks about what anything is anymore. They talk about what model (or map) can best be used to understand whatever we are investigating.
He would most probably say We the best music! 🤣✨️🥳
And what model or map would help us best answer the religion question? These are not mathematical questions. There is no formula or experiment we can conduct to arrive at a conclusion.
A probability scale. There are no conclusions.
How can you determine probabilities though?
I have been bitting my tung to say...
"Jesus just left the chat"...
Would be nice if he used some of those miracles to donate money to his church instead 😂
this is crazy #jesus #plebchain
mary sue: "rrrrr" 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Virginity rocks
Who is that 😂
By probing your own reality tunnel vs that of another’s and seeing how much you are willing to wage on your reality being more accurate than theirs.
Those are subjective numbers lol
i go a little further back to where the idea of “divine right to rule” came from. Somewhere around when Babylon emerged from Sumer.
😂
#Loooooooooool
