Is Monero a shit coin? Serious Question.
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@Hanshan
lolol
I'll give you a chance to prove yourself. open up tor browser. if you're really lazy, open up a tor tab in brave browser. go sign up for dread and try to shill cashu to the DNM people who congregate there. see what happens. maybe someone on there is brain damaged enough to fall for it, but you will most likely just get laughed out of the room. ecash is custodial garbage.
So there's no middle ground between Bitcoin and feces to you in terms of monetary value?
The average pair of socks and shoes "will go to zero when measured in Bitcoin" too so are they shit?
good point, but that's what shitcoins are truly, just casinos to try to end up getting more Bitcoin in a selfish manner by diluting Bitcoin itself, ending up in a zero sum game, a complete waste of time and energy.
My guy, HFSP.
Yes.
Some people don't mind shit. I do.
So you mind the socks and shoes you call "shit" but not the actual dog shit that gets on your bare feet when you step in it because you don't own socks or shoes?
Bitcoin is all about seperating money and state. In front of their eyes. And they can do nothing about it.
Total transparency gives trust and auditability to all everywhere.
The reason government don't like this mainchain superpower is because they lose the privilege of standing behind the curtain. Bitcoin audits their corruption.
Governments will probably choose monero over bitcoin if it was an pick one situation. Shitcoins trend to zero against bitcoin.
I pick up the dog shit and dispose of it in a compost pile. Then I feed the dog and pet him. And we play with the dog. I don't step in shit even with shoes on because some people actually manage to clean up more than just themselves.
I don't care if you buy or use monero. Shit people should shitcoin. One day they will get bitcoin at the price they deserve. The price might be shit shoveling.
Respond little shitcoin snot.
You're so desperate for attention you start begging for replies after less than an hour when the person you're talking to hasn't shown any activity in that time
But you're not desperate enough to try leaving retarded attempts at bullying out of your begging?
Kill yourself
wut?
Blackrock is buying up BTC and maxis are cheering it on,
meanwhile they've pressured almost every CEX in the Western world to delist Monero
and you say governments would pick Monero if they had the choice??
That's just obviously not what's going on.
Fiat charts are indicators of speculative degen interest and not of measurements of value
Governments want secrecy and control. Monero and fiat are similar in that regard. By using fiat governments retain both. They will never choose monero because it is inferior to fiat gor yheir purposes.
The reason governments are buying bitcoin is because game theory is forcing them.
If fiat was not an option then corrupt institutions would prefer monero to bitcoin to obfuscate their criminal behaviour.
One thing criminals don't tolerate is competition. They have no sense of freemarkets because free markets are morally ethical. Fiat monopolists won't tolerate monero as they won't tolerate a moneyprinter in your basement.
Bitcoins ethics forces governments to play nice otherwise they look like dictators when they ban it putting them in a hot seat with their constituents.
Bitcoin forces behaviour where monero obfuscates action.
You decide which is superior and allocate accordingly.
Think critically before you wut? Makes you seem reactionary and stupid.
You are playing 1 dimensional chess. Elevate your thinking and you might win.
found the Breedlove fan.
i prefer facts and information to arbitrary fantasy and hopium.
but as you say, the reader can decide.
When clever people get tired of arguing many big words to many dumb people they revert and channel their intelligence into a single phrase.
Monero is a shitcoin.
If you have an honest, unbiased and intelligent mind you will understand this wisdom.
If you don't you are a shitcoiner.
That was not so hard.
Repeat after me. "I am a shitcoiner. I love monero."
Honesty is a good thing.
"I am a very clever person
that's why I keep writing replies to this one post online"
rent free. lol
I am also a breedlove critic. Do you want facts?
What facts? I'll go get them for you.
You have said nothing of substance yet.
This is not a conversation, just you on a soapbox spouting theory.
You don't know enough about Monero to criticize it
You're just regurgitating Maxi taglines to be a team player.
throw down some facts or GTFO
Either you can fix the money, or you can play whackamole with intelligence agencies.
There is no try.
government / institutions buy the bitcoin, and sit on it, or rather let Coinbase sit on it. they then trade paper bitcoin and IOUs and futures and derivatives like they already do, not even touching the bitcoin that "backs" their financial system.
a transparent, auditable main chain exposes none of the shady business.
and they beat Bitcoin into submission. they never need to use it, they only need to "own" it.
GTFO of where?
Fact:
Monero is trending to zero against sats.
Fact:
Monero is a musical chairs game trying to fix bitcoin like zcash, dash and litecoin. When the scheme fails some slowly some quickly everyone ends up back at bitcoin because that is where the honest labourer is going to receive fair wages and save value in. Forever.
So monero is fun. Cool beans. Might be useful.
It will be used by those who are dissatisfied with the properties of bitcoin. I admire bitcoin for the same reasons you dislike it.
Transparency. This is a fundamental divide.
this is the new cult of monero narrative now
"but we need to be able to pay of the value of an average car like maybe once a year, but muh monero" lol
payments that size are usually for stuff like a whole car or a small piece of land
everything else can be moved around in small amounts
and you can use tor and only ever make spends or give addresses to send to via tor
you have to do that anyway even with monero, even if there is obfuscation about the payment when it appears on chain
the use case just doesn't exist for monero, and you'll eventually figure that out when it goes to zero
Time is the factor not taken into account here.
if bitcoin had scalable self-custody and monero-level privacy I would love that. but it doesn't have those things. it is failing to scale without custodians and it cannot offer a level of privacy similar to monero without exposing users to rug pull risk. I want it to overcome these problems but I don't think it will ever happen.
It is not a fiat chart. It's a sat chart.
ok there's one fact there
and its true the price is indeed lower than Bitcoins.
Fiat prices are indications of speculative interest by institutions and degens.
they do not measure value.
so it's really weird that people supposedly interested in freedom money bring that up immediately.
Free markets are better at discovering value and freedom is valuable and valued. The speculation is valuable too.
It is called signal. To measure signal you need an indicator. From the indicator you measure if your idea is good or bad.
It is so easy to understand a little child could figure it out intuitively. You are overthinking it.
Now you're the one failing to respond after over an hour when I asked you to explain what your careful walking had to do with my analogy
Not lower. It's going down forever.
which only means fiat exists and you're measuring prices in it
not the mic drop you think
Against sat. I don't think in fiat.
I did not get the notification. Cleaning my environment.
youre comparing two fiat prices and saying "its going down forever" dude
get a grip
You forgot the part where you apologize, but you don't seem capable of doing better anyway
I...
Monero is a shitcoin for shit people.
Change my mind.
Then who will feed my dog?
lmao at the maxis who seriously think the US government is going to spend their pentagon money through the bitcoin blockchain. how many cans of butane did they huff today
I found a more interesting person to argue with.
That is why I ignored you. You bored me.
Okay.
People who use monero are stuck in a cul de sac. An lonely echo chamber of having a secret coin but no peers to transact with. Go to your local butcher and explain to him that bitcoin is better money but monero is better, better money so buy bitcoin and find a bridge and exchange for monero... Or download this wallet and I will pay you but you cannot pay anyone else later. Effectively trying to convince him to hold a bag of secret coins that no one he knows wants and the ones who want it are not going to tell him because it's a secret.
Good luck with adoption.
Monero adoption is like homosexualism.
No organic growth. Just plain recruitment.
No game theory. Just a bunch of lonely guys holding bags.
Another - Why don't the MXR'rs build a social protocol where people zap each other monero and they can all show us how liquid their asset is.
Oh, it won't work, because we won't be there.
FYI, if nostr had an option where you could choose to zap sats or monero I would stop using nostr because I don't approve of shitcoinery.
Fiat is a shitcoin.
Gold is a shitcoin.
Monero is a shitcoin.
GTFO shitcoin apologists.
H.F.S.P.
it has fungibility
Didn't ask
When does the supply stop growing?
I would like to point out that Monero has less inflation than gold does and gold has been used as a store of value for thousands of years. Even the World Gold Council says that gold inflates at an average annual rate of about 1.5% per year, where Monero is 0.8% per year and falling asymptotically towards zero. The inflation rate keeps miners mining the chain because they have an incentive to do so and it replaces lost coins through lost private keys.
I said this amount as an example, but it's also true for 0.01 btc and it's not an incredibly uncommon amount.
What i mean is that lightning with its privacy works for microtransactions, for anything other than that you have to go on-chain with some tradeoff on privacy.
With monero, whether it's a micro or large transaction, privacy is on by default on-chain.
Yeah nostr is open source so technically anyone can add for their own client that features while others remain Bitcoin only
Guess you'll be leaving then.
https://mostard.org/
Or you need to call the nostr CEO and complain
GitHub
GitHub - retrnull/garnet: A fork of Amethyst with Monero tipping support
A fork of Amethyst with Monero tipping support. Contribute to retrnull/garnet development by creating an account on GitHub.
Already got that one.
Nice compilation
as I'm sure your aware
Monero has a .6 XMR block reward in perpetuity
so you *could* say "as time approaches Infinity so does the supply"
But at any given point in time the supply is known.
That is not "infinite Supply"
Even by your intellectually dishonest definitions.
You didn’t answer my question. When does the supply stop growing?
I said
"Monero has a .6 XMR block reward in perpetuity"
thats means it doesnt stop.
which answers your question.
i feel like you have reading comprehension problems.
I don't think a simple privacy protocol is enough to justify the value of an entirely separate money. The network effects and tendency toward consolidation in monetary networks is extraordinary.
I highly suspect the value of #Monero as measured in #Bitcoin will fall indefinitely. Maybe some of its network value will be sustained long term, kind of like Tor vs TCP/IP (open internet), but hard to say at this stage. Monetary transitions take a really long time.
I do stand by my comments that I think most of that community have cypherpunk values (rather than the outright stupid scams of the rest of "crypto"), and I think privacy is a very admirable value to be hyper focused on... but I genuinely don't think it keeps a separate monetary token alive on a long term time scale.
I think privacy will simply be a feature provided by many layers and networks that use BTC as their monetary base.
#Bitcoin is not even slightly captured by KYC. And the fact that there are more KYC exchanges is neither evidence of nor relevant to the idea that it is "captured" by KYC. It's an obvious result of simply being more widely available. That's all.
I get plenty of KYC free #Bitcoin, most of what I get is KYC free actually. Because its my money. I get paid in and pay people in Bitcoin directly.
Because the network actually has liquidity, I can use it as money. In no way whatsoever am I captured by KYC when using BTC day to day. I jsut zapped you 1,000 sats to prove it.
it simply cannot be a store of value. I see 2 possibilities. 1 they create some tech that will be replicated in bitcoin and monero dies. 2 they create some tech that cannot be replicated in bitcoin and some people will still move in and out when they need to do some black market/illegal transactions. I hope monero grows so it becomes relevant enough to get a really adversarial environment, and we find out how private it really is.
Monero is NGD tech
Don’t insult me, I haven’t insulted you. If you’re not capable of having a civil discussion then I’ll just mute you.
If there is no supply cap and the supply growth never stops, then the maximum supply is infinity. On an infinite timeline, the supply of monero trends toward infinity.
Idk why that’s hard to admit. That doesn’t mean monero can’t be useful in other ways. USDT is a shitcoin with an infinite supply but is still useful.
It's an altcoin going to zero against bitcoin. We can call it shitcoin for sure
It does not have a maximum supply and it is nearly impossible to audit the current supply
auditability, finality <--------> privacy, speed
base chain <--------> higher layers
It's nice to have options 👍
i would lmao but it's sad.
fair enough
I literally said exactly the same thing in the above note.
i just pointed out that "trending toward infinity" isn't the same thing as "infinite supply."
because at no point in time is the supply infinite.
to elaborate a bit to get the convo going
An artificial hard cap is a knee-jerk reaction to fiat insanity
it is not good monetary policy
It isn't rational to criticize Monero for an inflation rate that's lower than gold.
As if gold hadn't been a stable store of value for thousands of years...
I guess that’s where we differ. I think gold is a shitcoin too. Gold shares a lot of the qualities of other shitcoins. Obviously no maximum supply, we can find gold in the ocean and in space. You can’t trade large quantities of it across large distances efficiently. You can’t cross borders with your wealth in it. Its effective use needs a 3rd party. Gold was good at one point in the past on a small scale but it’s not great today.
bitcoin's effective use needs a third party. bitcoin developers have utterly failed to deliver scalable self-custody. now they are only able to scale via custodians. this is why you see so many people cheering for things like cashu, or institutions buying bitcoin and leaving it on coinbase. it is scaling via custodians. in a mass adoption scenario only ultra wealthy computer nerds and banks will be able to own their own coins, and everyone else will be forced onto a custodian whether they are responsible enough for self-custody or not. the custodians will have the power to nullify all the other benefits, even the fixed supply, because they are issuing IOUs.
I basically agree with those points regarding gold.
but we're discussing supply inflation.
and gold never became a poor store of value because of supply inflation
iow
a fixed and immutable supply isn't a requirement of money.
doing so has tradeoffs like everything else
but talking like its a necessary property of money is obviously contradicted by history.
That's all the point bitcoiners are missing, Bitcoin is stuck in regulations compliance, if you add real privacy on it, wall street will dump it or fork it. Bitcoin will become the enemy and bitcoiners don't want that, they want Bitcoin as a "digital gold" so let it be traceable with no privacy, you don't want to be that bad, Monero is here for that 😉
And what if you’re wrong and developers continue to improve second layer solutions that don’t rely on 3rd parties?
Fair. So the tradeoff is that everyone on the monero network pays for maintaining the network through inflation whereas everyone on the Bitcoin network pays to maintain the network when they transact. The main takeaway is that everyone has to pay in some way.
fucking do it. I'm still waiting. please knock my socks off. I expect bitcoin to give me scalable self-custody that doesn't require a degree in installing gentoo, and I expect monero-level privacy at the same time. but it doesn't have that right now.
yeah exactly
the general game theory on this is usually expressed through the "free rider problem"
basically
when there's network security cost and only a subset of users pay for it (people making txs)
everyone tries to be a "free rider", ie part of the group that *doesn't pay for security (hodlers).
according to the theory,
the security of such a network trends towards zero.
whether it works out that way in practice is of course another story.
but the point I want to make
is that tail emission is a legitimate tradeoff.
there are other tradeoffs Monero makes that can be criticized
but its not reasonable to argue tail emission makes it shitcoin IMHO.
Free-rider problem - Wikipedia
Rome wasn’t built in a day.
Why do you not expect bitcoin-level returns on your monero bag?
Do you hold bitcoin for savings at all?
of course
a lot of people are into cryptocurrency (yes bitcoin is one of those, satoshi called it that) because they expect returns. and they won't interact with anything that they are not certain will give them returns. they may even think that's all there is to it. if you are one of those people you are gonna be really confused when you meet someone who doesn't care as much. I don't need returns to convince me of utility. it's nice when it happens. ideally I should be getting both. but if I am getting returns but not the utility I want, I'm not going to think that's enough for me. if that still confuses you, too bad.
I literally don't think that bitcoin is going down the path of scalable self-custody. I think most of the developers either don't care about that anymore or they are too chickenshit to do any opcodes that may be required. it's going to take a lot of shifts in the community to change my mind about this. if it happens, I will be very happy. but it is very frustrating for me to sit here and see people shilling ecash as a replacement for monero right now and bragging about all sorts of things that actually haven't been accomplished yet and might never happen at all. I'd love if bitcoin actually became good enough to replace monero. fucking do it.
None of the either/or dilemmas you’ve listed here are actually either/or dilemmas. They need to be for Monero to have a long term value proposition at all, but they aren’t.
who people? smart people?
e-cash layer 2 is exactly this.
sorry monero 🌼
enjoy your turds. make some corn if you can. then buy Bitcoin🌼
it's both for monero actually. the network security budget is funded by both tail emission and transaction fees. but the fee revenue is not very significant. monero has about 20% of the daily transaction count of litecoin. if it gets used more then a greater share of the security budget will come from transaction fees.
Low quality chat bot
Not everyone. Holders don't pay, but they benefit, and those that spend subsidize the security on behalf of those that don't spend. It's a big problem that will increasingly become obvious as it rears it's head in the coming decades. I wrote up some detail on it in the linked note and more in the thread it is in
It's not about if transaction fees cover the cost of mining, it's about the fact that some people, holders, pay nothing to secure their wealth and that cost is subsidized by transaction fees. This isn't me complaining about some injustice or something, it is about the incentives on the bitcoin network.
Could they conceivably cover the costs of security?? For a time, yes, as you see now that is exactly what is happening, but ultimately incentives are your outcome. People are incentivized to hodl, because they can offload their security costs to those who spend or move around bitcoin, and it's compounding, it has a positive feedback loop; the more people just hodl, the more transaction fees have to cover the cost, the more incentive someone paying those fees has to just hodl. Ultimately, there's a threshold somewhere where security begins to decline, and with it, value.
Mining becoming cheaper with energy... I tried to look up the name of the phenomenon and I can't find anything (search engines filled with renewable energy blogspam) and I can't remember, but historically it has been empirically observed that, as energy becomes cheaper, people spend *more* on it and increase their energy usage. So far bitcoin has also followed this. Also, co wider increasing efficiency of ASICs does not lead to less mining power on the network, but simply a better edge to whoever can get their hands on it. Ultimately, security of the network is not a function of hash power, since machines get more powerful and cheaper, but is a function of share of total available hash power in the world held by the network, and that very closely correlates with energy expenditure by the network of miners. If the expenditure goes down, security does also.
View quoted note →
Sorry for butting in, but I think almost no one who supports and promotes #XMR is dumb, fanatical, or narrow-minded enough to not recognize #BTC. Sadly, the same can’t be said for the “BTC-only” crowd when it comes to psychological traits and intelligence.
I don’t really have a problem with monero. But a lot of monero shills come at me very aggressively and it’s pretty annoying lol
I value privacy but I have concerns about whether monero is liquid enough to function as a p2p cash alternative when I’m ready to spend my bitcoin. Large bitcoin whales buying in and selling out of monero is not practical because it’ll make the price more volatile. I know bitcoin is volatile but that’s part of the feature of bitcoin. Monero being volatile isn’t a good thing since it is being strictly used for transacting. Monero staying a small project and flying under the radar is probably best. Mass adoption is not realistic imo.
In a way, both yes and no. It enables anonymous payments without the need to navigate the complicated processes associated with Bitcoin, such as purchasing through non-KYC platforms, using coinjoin, mixing via Lightning, or swapping. However, it doesn’t serve as a store of value; individuals who hold it typically want to sell it as soon as possible, much like a hot potato.
Them poor bastards always looking to dunk on the king (bitcoin) in good times.
The holders paid to secure their wealth when they initially moved their funds to their wallet. It’s just that there isn’t an ongoing cost to holding it. But wealth that never moves is not beneficial. At some point they have to move it and pay a cost.
I think that energy will become cheaper over time but also that bitcoin will become more valuable over time as well. The subsidy continues to shrink but Bitcoin’s value continues trending up while hash continues to rise along with it.
Time will tell.
Bro
We’ll use any valuable code and features in bitcoin when we’re ready, don’t worry about it
I’m not worried about nothing related to cryptocurrency. Rest assured.
Just the way you call a coin as “king” resembles me that song.
Serious questions:
When will be that?
Is there a roadmap?
No joke.
There is an ongoing cost to holding it. Your wealth is secured by the network, without that security, your wealth is worthless. That security you get is subsidized by spenders, and this has incentive/game-theoretical implications for the bitcoin network that are not good. You can have the rarest of assets and if it can disappear while you sleep it's not worth anything.
Energy becoming cheaper... As energy becomes cheaper, people spend more on it by raising their energy usage. This is commonly observed everywhere in the world, and so far, empirically, this has held true for the bitcoin network as well.
I explained all of this stuff the other day in more detail in the following note, as well as another note in the same thread, if you want to give it a read to get a good idea of my thoughts on the matter.
It's not about if transaction fees cover the cost of mining, it's about the fact that some people, holders, pay nothing to secure their wealth and that cost is subsidized by transaction fees. This isn't me complaining about some injustice or something, it is about the incentives on the bitcoin network.
Could they conceivably cover the costs of security?? For a time, yes, as you see now that is exactly what is happening, but ultimately incentives are your outcome. People are incentivized to hodl, because they can offload their security costs to those who spend or move around bitcoin, and it's compounding, it has a positive feedback loop; the more people just hodl, the more transaction fees have to cover the cost, the more incentive someone paying those fees has to just hodl. Ultimately, there's a threshold somewhere where security begins to decline, and with it, value.
Mining becoming cheaper with energy... I tried to look up the name of the phenomenon and I can't find anything (search engines filled with renewable energy blogspam) and I can't remember, but historically it has been empirically observed that, as energy becomes cheaper, people spend *more* on it and increase their energy usage. So far bitcoin has also followed this. Also, co wider increasing efficiency of ASICs does not lead to less mining power on the network, but simply a better edge to whoever can get their hands on it. Ultimately, security of the network is not a function of hash power, since machines get more powerful and cheaper, but is a function of share of total available hash power in the world held by the network, and that very closely correlates with energy expenditure by the network of miners. If the expenditure goes down, security does also.
View quoted note →
h/t @mister_monster
legit concern
i solve this by having a stack of monero as well and move between the two just a few times per year
which means my fiat net worth is lower than it would be otherwise
but I'm highly critical of the maxi attitude that everything should revolve around maximizing your fiat equiv buying power
not really.
maxis are much more prone to find opportunity to dunk
and much LESS interested in discussing nuance.
also they famously are widely NOT interested in using new code with new features and often are fans of premature ossification.
View quoted note →
coming soon™
In today’s world, where we’re in a frenzy of technological evolution, it’s funny to see someone use “coming soon” (or something like that) to defend one technology over another for years. And these excuses get thrown around left and right with no shame. Some even use them with a bit of pride.
Easy. Be a maxi
Stop getting dumped on (and being poor)
Buy some bitcoin and enjoy the ride to $250k in 2025.
Cheers
👊🏻🧡🍻
Monero is a source of really good ideas that need to be implemented into Bitcoin, so Monero *can be* a shitcoin.
Everything good must be consumed by Bitcoin eventually, in one way or another, or Bitcoin is not good enough.
you got the wrong thread again bro
or just talking to yourself maybe
Nope. talkin to you.
Dont shit coin.
Monero is more like stacks of non-sequential $100 bills. It's an awful store of value. But it does provide privacy, which beats bank accounts, and can be transferred without physical travel, so there's some value add. All depends how much you're willing to pay for that in devaluation while using it. Given how much fiat gets wasted muling money around in the conventional financial space, this seems to suggest that monero is here to stay -- it just shouldn't be mistaken for a great savings vehicle.
Especially when the tools from Samourai Wallet (and the now forked Ashigaru Wallet) do a lot to close the gap using bitcoin-native methods.
dont do drugs kids
No one here used coming soon.
New features and tech take their damn long time trickling in to bitcoin.
That too is a feature.
I've remember when they said that lightning would be private
Ecash is custodial. Not even the same category as Bitcoin or Monero as it doesn't remove intermediaries.
I really have no idea why this gets repeated so much but it never sticks. do they think "custodial" is like a color or a flavor of potato chips or something?
Samourai no longer has Whirlpool, it was shutdown, so the privacy offered is considerably less than what it once was.
And even then it's privacy wasn't cheap, fast, or as robust as Monero offers. It also required you to run your own Dojo which most users simply aren't going to do.
You can buy Monero peer to peer on Bisq, for instance.
You can easily coinjoin BTC with Wasabi nowadays. You pick your own coordinator, they don't run one for obvious reasons. Works flawlessly.
They came for bitcoin exchanges.
I did not speak out, I can do self custody.
Then they came for tumblers.
I did not speak out, I'm not some "darknet hacker".
Then they came for self custody, code, privacy.
I did not speak out, surely this is our right?
Then they came for me.
Who will be left to speak for you?
"I don't believe we shall ever have a good money again before we take the thing out of the hands of government, that is, we can't take them violently out of the hands of government, all we can do is by some sly roundabout way introduce something that they can't stop."
F. A. Hayek
Bro don’t get sarcasm should avoid discussing. Pachorro Out!
Hey!! Don’t push them too much: BTC is a cheap cryptocurrency, have a really small network and the mining reward is smaller. They don’t have time nether resources to implement the coming soon features.
I thought it was cool what Kruw did to help decentralize the servers, but there are still a few disadvantages vs Monero
Largest inputs in a round have less privacy
Non-uniform amounts (more vulnerable to amount analysis)
Smaller anonymity set especially for recievers
Liquidity isn't shared between different coordinators
Still more expensive in tx fees
Do you have a link to the project?
I mean, I agree with all of this and have been very vocal about the referenced issues and in supporting and using the associated tech… but I don’t see how these have much relevance to the point we were discussing before about Bitcoin having been captured — implying that these technologies and non-KYC use is no longer possible and it’s now a permissioned system.
I think as the system got bigger, more people adjusted to obey the laws of their country. But at the same time the laws of the country have adjusted to adapt to the new technology. All revolutionary technologies work this way.
the Corn is a worldwide network on the uP! the olde network can't maintain! DoneDeal/ante uP/
hey players we need a cornhorn to play the Vibe(*_*)
say what?!
Ok but "quoting" is not the best kind of argument.
Lol I assume that my node is doing that for me, but we can apply that to XMR too, like how many monero people are running nodes either and verifying either? I got no issue with XMR, don't use it, would have been nice to see ring signitures on a Bitcoin side chain too but hey we make do with what we've got
It absolutely applies to xmr too
I just find it weird that people talk about Supply audibility as if they actually did it
There's also a disconnect because people are already trusting plenty of cryptographic primitives on bitcoin
It isn't the stretch to trust the range proofs that guarantee supply on Monero like people say
since its the first mover, I'm glad Bitcoin is transparent for the sake of public trust
but at this point I think it's retarded to insist on total transparency
I got those too if you'd like
Yes, it applies to both, but Bitcoin maxis are almost always the ones that bring up supply auditability as if they are actually personally verifying it themselves. In practice they're just relying on their node and trusting it to do it for them just like any Monero node runner.
note12jlsjff8dl952x4pdrajd9zzfrl9u6d5ja60wun4g6jexzykemdq6qwn9y
Unfortunately, the average Bitcoiner couldn’t care less about studying or learning about Monero. They’re mostly driven by greed. They have no interest in fungibility. Honestly, they’re kind of intellectually limited and extreme - they don’t even bother (or maybe don’t have the ability?) to read or watch content about anything other than Bitcoin. Luckily, here on Nostr, we’ve got some great examples of Bitcoiners who are more open-minded, smarter than average, and way less fanatical.
I got you pal, have a nice day 😁
Found this post that gives an alternative perspective on energy demand. Read the first section on AI energy use.
“But energy demand did not follow in the same way … Between 2010 and 2018, global data centre compute increased by more than 550%. Yet energy use in data centres increased by just 6%.”
Weekly Progress Roundup
AI is becoming more efficient, rising cancer diagnoses signal progress, ChatGPT may replace your doctor.
I'll read it, but just your quote says demand went up in the study, not down, which is what I'm saying. Compute increased 550% and energy usage 6%, if your projection was right it would've gone up 300% or something and energy usage gone down. That's not what we see empirically anywhere in the world. Where efficiency goes up, new energy demand outpaces it.
What about stonewall 1 and 2, ricochet, and stowaway? Did they go the way whirlpool did?
Haven't had a chance to do the research on the back end -- didn't realize any of this was centralized enough to be shut downable.
Stonewalls and Stowaways are still possible I think.
Not sure what was so special about Ricochet, but it's down too - it just moved your coins a few addresses before sending to an exchange which anyone can do themselves.
Sad part is they were in the process of decentralizing coordinators for Whirlpool and implementing Monero atomic swaps. Suspicious timing for the feds to show up for sure.
Is there an FAQ or website you would refer someone to that wanted to learn more?
Didn't Calle just shit on Monero recently?
Not that I know of, but if he did this was made over a month ago
Ah, mmmmh. I need to find the post.
Ah, I am thinking of this one
I guess he meant hold as invest, understanable.
calle (npub12r…485vg) on Nostr
Short Text Note by calle
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Oh I thought you meant him specifically calling out Monero. Yes, I remember this one.
Having them consider Monero the best "shitcoin" is about all I can expect from a hardcore Bitcoin maxi is how I look at it lmao (Would never really expect anything more. Can't even imagine a maxi saying Monero is on par or better than Bitcoin. Can you?)
Them even saying that Monero stands above the rest of crypto is almost an admission and achievement in and of itself.
I love this thread so much because of all the blind, and pointless fighting 😂.
In order not to slide into populism, such publications, in my opinion, should be accompanied by links to sources. This will greatly increase the value of the meanings conveyed.
Bisq - A decentralized bitcoin exchange network
Bisq - A decentralized bitcoin exchange network
Bisq is an open-source desktop application that allows you to buy and sell bitcoin in exchange for national currencies, or alternative cryptocurren...
I'll do this when I get a chance
